Home » Browns » Breaking faith with Browns fans.

Breaking faith with Browns fans.

Screen Shot 2013-09-09 at 8.21.25 AM

Speaking only for myself:  I found my Browns fan experience yesterday largely unchanged from past years.  How was yours?

The CSAT numbers can’t be good; perhaps a note to the VP of Fan Experience is in order.

Because, I kid you not, the Browns can afford such an executive although apparently they cannot afford a probowl, never-missed-a-start center.  (We’ll get to Alex Mack.)

After an off-season featuring the implementation of new office furniture and the adoption of analytics-to-improve-personnel talk (if not use); after healthier cafeterias and improved stadium cell service; after the junking of the dinosaur 4-3 defense in favor of the the current preferred turbo/hybrid attacking aggressive 3-4; after prudently eschewing free-agency use in favor of building through the draft (albeit next year’s draft); and dee-jays don’t forget dee-jays … it turns out that when you don’t significantly improve the roster of a 5-11 team, they continue to look like a 5-11 team.

And yet in yesterday’s #CheddarBay work, our generally savvy pickers threw down a collective 39 points on the Browns versus one point on the Dolphins.  It goes to show how the reportage on the Browns has been wanting for objective, sober analysis.

The question I have is who let you down more:  The Banner regime and its dedication to window dressing or the Cleveland sports media and its fawning over it?

They both thought you were pretty dumb; they’re soon to find out you can be pretty pissed before lapsing into wholly apathetic.  It’s a longshot but:  the Browns and their sycophantic reporters are actually at risk of losing the best sports fan base in the country.

I’ll work the media angle today.


Stop me if this looks familiar.

I’m not going to dig into the problems we saw yesterday.  Thin offensive line?  Pass rush not a panacea?  Vulnerable secondary?  Nope, I’ve done some work on the problematic talent acquisition strategy of this off-season.  Just some.  Here’s a taste of what’s been written here at Kanick and you can dive into it at these links:

2013 Brown preview (Indifference); TRich, Dancing Bear; The Fallacy of Attacking 3-4 defensesHaving a short secondaryParsimonious Joe BannerAlex Mack, Y U NO SIGN HIMNo one cares about Berea’s makeoverJoe Banner’s window-dressing strategyNorv Turner, paid gun for hireGimmicky defenses reliant on personnel packages for specific down/distances are soon to be obsoleteShort d-back issue not tended to in draftThe lunacy and hypocrisy of trading out of the fourth and fifth rounds after eschewing free-agency with the ‘Build through the draft’ mantraShort d-backs (with math)Drafting redundant pass-rusherCommitment to non-ExcellenceHow did a front line with Taylor, Rubin, Sheard become a focal point for renewal? Short d-backs (Kerry Rhodes please)Explaining salary cap rollover and Banner’s hoarding of sameWhat a smart draft looks likeILB depth (draft Alec Ogletree)Defining the needs of the team and addressing them through free-agency and draftO-Guard depth (sign Andy Levitre)Short d-backs (sign Keenan Lewis); Why the 4-3 is inherently better.

No since I’ve done that already, today it’s worth looking at how people who are actually paid to cover the team are serving their readers.

An ominous beginning.

The day started on a sour note with a La Canfora’s tweet.

If any paid media member so much as asked Joe Banner about Alex Mack in a salary cap context, let alone got a meaningful response, I surely missed it.  As it stands, I’m pretty sure that some guy with a blog in NH is the only one asking the obvious question:  what the hell are you doing with $30 million in unused cap while Alex Mack is about to become the best and pretty much only UFA Center to hit the market in six months?

No that’s not a question we see raised in when talking with Berea.  Instead the Banner Charm Offensive yields reporting like this.

The Browns will have the second least-experienced roster in the NFL.  They have a new coaching staff, an unproven quarterback and a dismal recent history.  So what should fans watch this season?


Barrett Jones, fourth round pick of the Rams.

Hey Terry, thanks for noticing the absurdly young roster.  But if the Browns have such an inexperienced roster, we fans already know what we’ll be watching.  The better questions to the person who assembled the roster are:

  • Why are the Browns so inexperienced when you’ve had more salary cap space than pretty much any other team?
  • How does the strategy of building through the draft square with trading out of the draft?
  • Given your unwillingness to sign Alex Mack, wouldn’t drafting an Outland and Rimington Trophy winner, two time BCS Champion who started at both guard and center be a better use of that fourth round pick you traded to our biggest and in-division rival?
  • Aren’t you punting this season?

I mean,, you know?  You Mr. Journo are supposed to be serving the fans.  You get access to these people that we can’t.  But instead you’re serving Berea.  This is a problem.

But perhaps Banner does have a Jedi mind trick going on because next up in non-investigative fan-boy journalism is Tom Reed:

Franchise’s new aggressive mentality has these dawgs ready to attack [!!!]

But seldom in the last 14 years has the franchise’s connective tissue coursed with such a singular thread: Don’t be afraid to take a chance. Whether it’s placing a deejay on the field before kickoff to goose the game-day experience, employing a high-risk defense with an inexperienced secondary or letting the meter run out on the contract of a beloved Pro Bowl kicker, the Browns are eschewing convention.

Mother of God.  I know things are tough at the PD but isn’t it bad form to interview publicly with the Browns?  Don’t they still have Vic Carucci?

You have options.

The good news is that it’s not too too hard find candid and honest takes on the Browns from people who are not beholden to Berea for the sacred ‘access’ to players and coaches.  I’m on the job and you can count on Frowns and Kolonich and Passan in this area too while our ink-strained wretches figure out this twitter thingy:

Screen Shot 2013-09-09 at 9.09.58 AM



  1. Kanick, THANK YOU for bringing up the media here. I felt like I have been crazy on the message board I frequent because I think not only the Cleveland media’s skewed view, but the national media’s (which is predominantly negative) both make following this football team very difficult (frustrating) at times. If I wasn’t fortunate enough to have a decent environment to talk about the team… I don’t know what I would do. I’ve followed since the Browns were ‘reborn’ on account of I used to love CFL football, but only obsessively close since the Mangini years and the media has just gone nutty. However, I don’t think a lot of fans are waking up to it, I’m kind of disconnected from that so I’m not seeing it, but I wish more fans of this team would call this out as you have here.

    • jimkanicki says:

      Thanks back. I sometimes think I’m too harsh but notes like this help me trust myself. I would also add that Scott Raab on the WFNY podcasts is in lock-step on this point.

  2. As always, late to the game here. Kanicki is on point with his comments and yes, this draft could rank as one of the Browns’ worst ever – which is saying a lot considering the last 15 years. Sunday could have used a FA guard, CB, LB, S and many other things. But then again, the FO basically punted this season away with that mess of a draft in April.

    Anyway, as for the O-Line. I think the hidden weakness of the team is the interior O-Line. I’m not as sold on Mack as Kanicki is – mainly because good centers tend to be great ones in free agency. Mack should be re-signed, but it wouldn’t be the end of the world if he’s not. Basically, the entire interior of the O-Line needs to be replaced. Greco is barely a starter and if we’re counting on Shawn Lauvao to save us, we’re in trouble.

    While I agree that T-Rich “dances” a bit too much, I also see very few holes for him to run through. On Sunday, the only real chances he had was to the outside behind Joe Thomas. Granted, he didn’t get many runs called for him but then again, given the way the interior O-line was beaten, I really can’t blame Turner and Chudzinski.

    If the Browns are going to keep Mack, they seriously need to find two guards to put on opposite sides of him. Otherwise, that money probably needs to go somewhere else. And hopefully, we’re not witnessing the inevitable regression of Mitch Schwartz. As I suggested in my 99 Problems thingy, he may have already peaked as an NFL tackle. He just looked bad, bad, bad against Cameron Wake.

    And wasn’t the O-Line supposed to be a team strength?

    We already knew QB was bad and the secondary beyond Haden stinks, but now this too?

  3. I have a couple of main thoughts here…

    One is this dream of going 6-10 and winning the division then finding a way to win 4 games in a row so we can be the team that can print up World Champion 10-10 t-shirts and change the playoff rules forever. Because Cleveland.

    The one year that 8-8 wins this division and the front office puts out a roster in which almost 20% of roster has zero experience. They are sitting on a small mountain of cash and addressed none of the issues which could have helped the team. I mean who issues a jersey to Buster Skrine again with a straight face. They easily could have spent the money and made a run at the division this year.

    (On a baseball note I call this my KC Royals theory…the Royals fan base has been beaten down for so long that the Royals front office made a short term move this year so that they could have a winning team. Bring the fans back…show them a winner and try and go from there even if you trade your best prospect who could be a star in Tampa for 15 years. It’s worth it for the psyche of the city. The only flaw with this regarding the Browns is that amazingly I don’t think there is anything that would keep fans away now.)

    I don’t blame Weeden for yesterday but let’s face it…he is not the answer. On a side note if he makes all 16 starts this year and is not eating through a straw I will respect him forever.

    The punter and the kicker were good yesterday.

    I just can’t get mad about it anymore…it’s going to be a long season but I guess if we were paying attention to their actions all summer this is not really all that surprising.

  4. bupalos says:

    I really can’t go with the “see I told you so” analysis there. Alex Mack not being under contract for next year is not even the tiniest little bit of the problem. Looking at resources and holes, I actually lean towards investing that money elsewhere. Centers have been plummeting in value with the decline of the power run, and still may be overvalued. Put it this way: we have a top 3 center and this is what our run game and pass protection looks like. There’s a reason these guys don’t start coming off the board until the 3rd round.

    Here’s 3/4 of our problem, listed hierarchically:

    Weeden being Weeden;
    both our right guards being injured;
    Gordon sippin on drank;
    Little bobbling almost everything;
    Richardson breaking out into full-on “bust” status.

    Here’s the other 1/4– the defensive backfield is thin.

    Overall, the defensive performance was good yesterday, though just like in Rob Ryan’s first few weeks, the blitzes were not well disguised, coordinated, or timed with the rest of the D. They were noticeably better the more vanila they played. To me that says the defense is just not fully installed or matured. But the front seven got consistent pressure and they stoned the run like no Browns team in 20 years.

    I’ll agree they haven’t invested everything they could have to win this year. And that may be a shame if Weeden does somehow magically grow a brain, work ethic, and some desire and becomes a mediocre QB. That seems unlikely enough that it’s hard to get too worked up about them leaving the secondary thin.

    • This sounds right to me.

    • jimkanicki says:

      >>> I actually lean towards investing that money elsewhere.>>>
      History tells us this means another front 7 player.

      >>>Centers have been plummeting in value with the decline of the power run, and still may be overvalued.>>>
      Tell that to the Seahawks (Max Unger). Pay close attention to the Steelers and Ravens this year who now have have to replace their stud centers (Birk, Pouncey). And the scouting report on Trent Richardson is power run game ever if we haven’t seen it; the guy aint exactly built like Eric Metcalf.

      This sounds to me like the same prevailing attitude when Ross Tucker needed be replaced. “No prob, right tackles arent that important and easy to find in free agency.” Next thing you know we’ve got three years of Shaeffer, StClair, Pashos.

      Not for nothing but Weeden being Weeden had a lot to do 6 sacks; 16 hits; and shitty o-line play. But your solution is to replace Alex Mack with a center from the Oneill Cousins bin at Goodwill. Honestly Bup, I think you’re off your game here.

      Think of it this way Bup: Haslam is going to take that $30,000,000 in unspent player payroll and either buy that UTenn tract of shale, or build more truck stops, or fund some republican superPAC, or all three. That surely being the case, wouldn’t you rather he extend Alex Mack?

      • bupalos says:

        Part of the problem is I don’t really think Mack is all that great. He’s good. He’s reliable. He doesn’t really move people. And extending HIM isn’t a one year use-it-or-lose-it in the fracking hole issue. It’s a question of how the money on the line is structured for the next few years. I’d much rather take my chance at center with a 4th rounder like everyone else does and buy a serious guard. They are more important as difference makers. Or wad it all up and throw it at a QB that doesn’t suck in multiple ways. There are simply higher impact places to spend your money.

        You know how everyone tries to cite the Ravens that one year to prove you don’t NEED a great QB to win a superbowl? You could probably do that for center with 9 out of 10 superbowl winners.

        • NeedsFoodBadly says:

          So here’s some data for the past 10 Super Bowl winning centers.

          2013 – Ravens – Matt Birk – All Pro 2x, Pro Bowl 6x -drafted 6th round as a tackle (by Vikings)
          2012 – Giants – David Baas – 2nd Round (by 49ers)
          2011 – Packers – Scott Wells – Pro Bowl 1x – 7th round (by Packers)
          2010 – Saints – Jonathan Goodwin – Pro Bowl 1x – 5th round (by Jets)
          2009 – Steelers – Justin Hartwig – 6th round (by Titans)
          2008 – Giants – Shaun O’Hara – All Pro 1x, Pro Bowl 3x – UDFA, Browns
          2007 – Colts – Jeff Saturday – All Pro 2x, Pro Bowl 6x – UDFA, Ravens
          2006 – Steelers – Jeff Hartings – All Pro 2x, Pro Bowl 2x – 1st round, Lions
          2005, 2004 – Patriots – Dan Koppen – All Pro 1x, Pro Bowl 1x – 5th round, Patriots

          What stands out to me is that yes, most were drafted low. And most won Super Bowls with a different team than drafted them. But most were all pro/pro bowlers at some point in their career so make of that what you will.

          • bupalos says:

            Good look. It’s interesting how much the center position rotates so frequently at the pro bowl. A lot of different guys seem to get this “great center” designation at different points.

            Not a whole lot of these guys stand out for me, I do remember just from paying attention to the steelers that in ’06 Hartings was kind of broken down and had to take a pay cut to stay on the team and possibly in the league, so that’s at least one asterisk there. When I get a chance, I’m going to look up the actual salaries of these guys in the years we’re talking about, I think that might be more instructive on the argument on whether or not “pro-bowl center” Mack should be paid the likely 7-8M he’s looking for.

            • NeedsFoodBadly says:

              For what it’s worth, both Steelers centers were replaced immediately after their Super Bowl wins.

              I didn’t record it, but going through the centers, it seemed to me that most were fairly experienced at their positions at the time that their team won the Super Bowl. Late 20s, early 30s, and been around the league long enough to be on two or three teams.

              Pro Bowl selections are a wonky thing, particularly for a low-visibility position like a center, so I wonder how much longevity (and thus possibly name recognition) figured into their pro bowl selections. But it would seem that having an experienced veteran at the spot might make a difference in team play.

        • jpftribe says:

          I think what the data shows is first round centers don’t grow on trees. Further if the brain trust had drafted Cooper or Warmack, they would have three first rounders, a second, and Greco. Any third round RB would run for 1500 yards, Richarson included, AND any FA or draft pick QB would be pounding at the door to be here.

          Not only was that feasible, it would cost the FO NOTHING over what they have today, cept maybe a few million per year for Mack, most of which would not be guaranteed. They would still have 25-27M in cap.

          If you want to talk rebuilding, this is a story I can buy.

          • jpftribe says:

            And they left the best Center to come out in years on the board in the fourth round in Barrett Jones. Could’ve had him for nothing.

    • jpftribe says:

      The only thing I disagree with here is if you fix the Weeden being Weeden problem next year, Alex Mack fleeing Cleveland rises to the top of the list. And you still have issues at guard.

      • bupalos says:

        >>>if you fix the Weeden being Weeden problem next year, Alex Mack fleeing Cleveland rises to the top of the list>>>

        It really really doesn’t rise to the top of the list. You can have a great offense with a mediocre center. You can have a good offense with a bad center. You cannot have a good offense with a bad quarterback or bad wide receivers. You cannot have a good defense without solid corners or defensive ends.

        There might be 1 or 2 counter examples, but reality is reality. If you made a list of the positions on the field you can often afford to fudge a bit, center is near the top. That’s what the draft market says, that’s what playoff outcomes say, and that’s reality.

        None of that is to say that great centers can’t be difference makers, especially in certain matchups. But I don’t know that mack is “great,” and there are simply more important places to invest.

  5. tmoore94 says:

    It’s rather amazing, even by the low standards of the Browns, that every questionable area of the team was exposed against Miami.

    Weeden still looks as uncomfortable as he did last year; they still don’t run Richardson enough to have him make a difference; the right guard position is a mess; the receivers still drop the ball at the most inopportune time; the front seven looked good but faded, and the difference between being a good defense and a very good defense is the ability to hold up for the entire game; Buster Skrine is not a starting corner back (and Chris Owens may not be one either).

    There was one area of the offensive play calling that was troubling. As I touched on in my TCF post, prior to the Browns falling behind by 10 points and being forced to pass, Weeden was lined up in the shotgun and/or pistol 32 times and the Browns passed from those sets 29 times.

    If I can see that sitting on my couch and tracking it with a pencil and notebook, opposing defensive coaches can certainly see it and, if they know the Browns are going to pass every time (or nearly every time) Weeden is not under center, that certainly decreased the likelihood that the play is not going to work out in the Browns favor.

    The Browns don’t play an overly difficult schedule this year, and the Dolphins are not a good team, but if yesterday is any indication, it’s not going to matter.

  6. Beef says:

    Kanick said: “the Browns and their sycophantic reporters are actually at risk of losing the best sports fan base in the country”.

    That’s not an exaggeration. Like all of us, I’m a committed lifer – who lived and died thru RR88, Drive, Fumble, losing the team; who went into seasons in the ’70’s with backfields of Hugh McKinnis and Billy Pritchett still thinking this year we’d run all over the Steelers; who has endured the never-ending haplessness of the teams since returning, all the while entering Game One each year with sky-high hopes after the local writers painted valentines of the rosters year in and year out regardless of the actual talent on hand; etc etc. And last week, while I was reading the guys like Kanick, who not only see that the emperor has no clothes on but actually have the nerve to declare such blasphemy in the city of Emperor Banner, it finally dawned on me – why do i need to keep investing so much time and emotion to this team – they aren’t even TRYING to give back any more. This front office is yakking up the game day experience touting circus acts and fireworks, seemingly not even aware that putting a winning team on the field will mean that no one will give a rat’s behind if they can’t see a wiener dog race before the game. Hello!!! KNOCK KNOCK KNOCK! Joe Banner, is anyone home?!!

    The stadium was jampacked in the late 80’s while they were winning divisions, and at all those sold-out games, I can’t remember ever seeing a DJ out there before the Browns came out of the tunnel to thunderous applause. And while the usual valentine massacres are still coming from the local mainstream scribes, leading many fans to comment on how this is the year, same as they do every year, i finally took off those rose-colored glasses and saw this roster for what it is. And so i wasn’t even mildly surprised that the Browns were beaten yesterday – and that in itself was what was so depressing about the loss. I’ll bet it came as no surprise to Banner, either. I agree with Frownie’s post on here – I think LomBanner have already thrown this season out and are making their plans for next year – they may not have even watched the game yesterday. All you Weeden fans, enjoy him while you have him, because he won’t be here next year (if he even lasts through this year – LomBanner may employ the Charlie Frye Gambit). Suspecting this entire season is just a throwaway – when the season has just started – is a depressing reality. I know Chud & his staff will be doing their best, but they weren’t given anything to improve with (not to mention Horton is just here to leverage himself for a play for head coach next year, hence the shave and a haircut, two bits).

    The thought of giving up on the Browns is heresy for any Browns fan, ever – but praise the lord and pass the football, I’m so tired of the incessant incompetence, along with the blatant condescension from the front office this year, that literally for the first time ever, I’ve found myself at least wondering why I should keep bothering with the Browns…

    • jpftribe says:

      To add to that thought, watching the game yesterday was just not enjoyable, at all. Their touchdown “drive” was seriously painful to watch. Then having watched niners GB, Dallas NYG, Philly Wash, it becomes even more pathetic. Yeah they are only 0-1, and so is everyone in the division, but they looked really bad compared to the real teams.

  7. zarathustra says:

    Alternate reality: the browns follow the kanick offseason plan.
    Who is the starting qb? What is that team’s cieling over the next say 3-4 seasons?

    • jimkanicki says:

      Oh that’s easy:

      Weeden is still your starter and has plenty of time to choose between Gordon/Little/Benjamin/Keller standing upright behind Thomas-Levitre-Mack-Greco/Pinkston/BJones-Schwartz and the Harvard FB from Medina.

      On defense the underneath seams would be covered by Ogletree dropping back; Groves is jumping to add pressure; KLewis is helping Haden on the edge; Bacarri Rambo is patrolling centerfield with Ward.

      Per Zac J, the dude was sacked six times, with “16 quarterback hits and 10 pass deflections.” Hard to kill Weeden on that.

      • zarathustra says:

        Ok. So that means weeden is the long-term answer at qb, sheard is your best pass rusher and have zero flexibility going forward. I hate to keep hectoring for examples, but please cite the contending team that doesn’t have at least one first-round pass rusher. As a matter of fact, how many lack one drafted in the top ten?

  8. I agree that yesterday was completely horrendous, but what if they really are tanking this season to draft a franchise QB. They couldn’t out and say it if that’s what they’re doing. So if that’s what they’re doing, can one really be so upset about it?

    • jimkanicki says:

      Deferred gratification hasn’t worked out so great for recently or ever. I understand what you’re saying but I say they should have been all in to win this year and if Weeden wasn’t the answer, use the mountain of cash to sign… oh you know:

      • Yes but there was plenty of reason to believe that Weeden was terrible going into this season, and there’s plenty of reason to prefer drafting a franchise QB to lining up a dump truck of cash for a free agent.

        • jimkanicki says:

          Actually, there was a fair amount of reasonable hope that playing out of a shotgun in a ‘vertical offense’ would suit Weeden better than Shurmurball. Who knew they’d play Shurmurball yesterday.

          Drafting a QB is as risky as signing one (unless you’re able to draft Andrew Luck). Plus in the draft a QB game, the new regime gets to set their timetable back yet another three years cos, you know, developing a young QB.

          • zarathustra says:

            “Drafting a QB is as risky as signing one (unless you’re able to draft Andrew Luck)”
            But we have to draft one, because under your plan we would not have the cap space to sign a qb in free agency.

            • jimkanicki says:

              Guy. See my alt reality reply to you for the ‘Kanick plan.’ The ‘Cutler signing’ uses the current reality and is bid to make some kind of sense about why we’re hoarding cash today.

              If you’re sanguine with your 5-11 team being prudent with a billionaire’s money.. knock yourself out waiting quietly through this reboot that has no end, no urgency.

              All I’m saying is that it didn’t have to be like this, they don’t give a rat’s ass what happens this year so long has a vague claim of progress can be made, and I’m not happy about it.

  9. jpftribe says:

    You know Kanick, the problem I have with you is, well, you’re right. I mean not just now, but almost all of the posts, as documented above. And it pisses me off. I don’t want you to be right, I want you to be wrong.

    For a year now, I’ve been waiting to see what it would be like to get rid of Shurmur, and Holmgren and, and and…

    And now, we have what we have, and its not very good, and it makes no fucking sense. I mean, you’re right. Some guy in NH, or Singapore, or Cleveland, or, or or….. Can sit back and say yeah nice office, but we don’t have any cb’s, or safeties, or guards, a plethora of 2nd string QB’s, a pro bowl center going UFA, one receiver on drugs and the other might as well be…… Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah…..

    You don’t have to look at the Cleveland media for the answer tho….. The Browns own PR dept have provided you the answer:

    You’re right once again, another , you fill in the blank number, of years of rebuilding. Rebuilding by guys who passed on Cooper or Warmack for Mingo, failed to trade down to stock LB and Safety, punted on Jones in the fourth round, drafted yet another DE, admittedly on drugs, signed their kicker three days before the season after having filled out their roster with nine rookie free agents. Meet the new boss………

    Pluto is the only mainstream media guy left with half a brain, but like me, doesn’t have it in his heart to believe it to be true. So keep waving the flag, fighting the good fight. I’ll keep reading it. But it still pisses me off.

    • zarathustra says:

      Yep. All the evidence is in. This regime has been proven a failure. 0-1. Let’s clean house.

      • jimkanicki says:

        The evidence that they aren’t trying to be as good as possible this year is now in, yes.

        And there is no evidence that deferred gratification is a better plan. After all, when has it worked for the Browns?

        • zarathustra says:

          Hmm. I thought the evidence showed that they were missing two starters from the front seven and had a third-stringer at right guard.
          They lost a game. I don’t think not blowing your cap in year one is any kind of indictment against the new regime. Especially considering it is pretty obvious they are lacking a long term answer at qb. The front office acted prudently this offseason. I am very interested in an example of any successful franchise that exacted anything close to the kanicki plan in year one.

          • jimkanicki says:

            Given that they came into camp with a suspect starting guard (Lauvao), a journeyman FA at the other guard (Greco), and another guard who almost died last year (Pinkston), OG depth was known issue. Tending to it with a 7th rd pick is personnel malfeasance.

            And I remind you they have $30M in cap space.

            You sure you want to back them up. I get your taking a counterpoint to me on this post but .. you’re really cutting them slack on their offensive guard staffing??

            • zarathustra says:

              A billionaire’s money is relatively infinite. But we are not discussing how a billionaire spends money. We are discussing cap space which is finite. So I am not sanguine about a billionaire sitting on money. I am sanguine about a front office sitting on cap space. There is quite a difference.
              This is game one of year one of a new regime. Sorry. That is the realty. I appreciate if you are fed up with the circumstances of the browns this past decade, but that doesn’t change the reality of this being year one.

            • zarathustra says:

              They did trade for moffit. But I think it is a fair point that the interior line is thin and more should have been to provide depth.

        • zarathustra says:

          I trust you understand that I value your knowledge and understanding of the game, but I don’t believe you are adequately assessing the downside risk to your proposed plan. To be honest, it doesn’t seem that different from butch davis approach in year one. And I suspect it would have a similar ceiling.

          • jimkanicki says:

            I don’t think my plan is so radical: See hole, fix hole.

            Seems a hell of a lot more sensible than: See team, replace defense, build pass rush, ignore secondary, etc.

            Ya dig? I can’t understand what this group has done to earn your trust that they’ll be any different than any other group preceding them.

            • Beef says:

              LomBanner has a slightly less radical plan – see hole, hump hole.

            • zarathustra says:

              Part of the disconnect here is that you don’t think your plan is radical. I believe it would have been not only radical, but irresponsible to the long-term prospects of the team. (See butch davis)
              And yes, see defense replace defense. If the old defense was the definition of medocrity and most successful teams are running said new ddefense.
              Just as you can’t understand how they have earned my trust I cannot understand your certainty that they will fail. . .after one offseason, one training camp, and ONE game.
              I understand you were far to patient with the previous clowns, but. . .ONE game

        • Luke Seubert says:

          The worst part of all this is that the Browns will suck badly enough to get a really great 1st Round draft pick next Spring. And yet, we all know deep in our hearts, that Banner and Lombardi will totally blow this pick. There is overwhelming documented evidence proving their awful track records as football personnel guys.

          So, the Browns have poor talent and no legitimate hope of getting better talent. Sigh….

          • zarathustra says:

            They are 0-1. And there is nothing like overwhelming evidence to their awfulness here or anywhere previously.

            • jimkanicki says:

              Again, the flip side to your patience preaching is that we let two years go by before firing Shurmur and then rebooting again. What is wrong with saying that was a turd yesterday and moreover a foreseeable turd.

              • zarathustra says:

                What is wrong with it is that it is a ridiculously narrow standard to evaluate future success. Has a regime ever succeeded after losing one game? Is there even ever so slight of a possibility you may be wrong about these guys?

Comments are closed.

Cheddar Bay Leaderboard

Cheddar Bay pick frequency.

Promoting blogs and things.

. . . . . . . . . .

Recent Posts

%d bloggers like this: